Why Ex-Vegans Eat More Meat Than They Must

Dan Cudahy of “Unpopular Vegan Essays” — a popular essay blog amongst the abolitionist-leaning “logical vegan” crowd — has written a generally ignored and ostracized essay addressing the excitement over “A Vegan No More”. In “On Ex-Vegans”, Cudahy writes that ex-vegans don’t exist, by definition, because the definition of true veganism includes the word “lifelong”:

For some of us, “vegan” means a strong, lifelong, and morally internalized commitment to avoiding the use of animals and animal products as much as is reasonably possible in an extremely speciesist society that uses animal products ubiquitously. … There may be a lot of “ex-vegans”, but when they were “vegans”, what did that mean? Did they go without animal products for several hours daily (“vegan before 6pm”)? Did they go on a “vegan health diet” for a few weeks, months, or years only as a fad diet right after their Atkins diet? If they were vegan for “animal rights” reasons, what did they mean by that? Are they referring to a concern about animal welfare?

If you aren’t vegan for life, you never had the commitment that true veganism entails, which means you were never vegan. So much for the ex-vegan problem. Although this may create a new problem if “lifelong” is taken to mean “covering the entirety of one’s life,” since that would exclude everyone except for vegans from birth to death at an old age, which so far is no one. Hopefully Cudahy doesn’t mean that.

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Is Taste the Basest of Our Desires?

Alex: Finally, how can you use “taste”, the basest of our desires, to justify causing unnecessary harm and death?

HaRav Avraham: No, the purpose of the kid is not merely to be food for your sharp teeth, sharpened and polished by your lowliness and gluttony in eating meat; and certainly the milk is not intended to be a condiment for the satisfaction of your base desire.

Volatile: In any case, my point here is that you’re not “doing your best”, because you neglect to take even simple steps to change your behaviour, or to even accept that there is something morally problematic about eating meat. You allow base desire for taste to cloud your moral judgment. 

B.R. Myers: The pleasures of the oral cavity (though we must say ‘palate’ instead) are now widely regarded as more important, more intrinsically moral, and a more vital part of civilized tradition than any other pleasures. … Advertising has abetted the trend, while political correctness, with its horror of judging anyone’s ‘lifestyle choices,’ has done its bit to muffle dissent.

Kropotkin: Your story today on the “best” types of beef cuts would be absurd were it not so irresponsible. With livestock contributing about 18% to global warming and the environmental destruction farmers cause in their raising, you do not seek to promote the point that the biggest contribution people can make in reducing their own ecological footprint is to stop eating meat - instead you glorify it by appealing to base desire. Shame on you for your obscene capitulation to personal hedonism ahead of environmental and ethical concern.

Anna: BHealthy, you are so right and I am not doing the self flagellation. I do, however, read about the factory farms periodically so that compassion overwhelms my most base desire most of the time. How I know this is addiction is that I can actually put that stuff in my mouth knowing what I do.

Gary Lawrence Francione: What is troubling to me is the notion that our taste – the pleasure that we get from eating something, someone, from inflicting pain, suffering and death, whether it’s direct pleasure or indirect pleasure. I mean the bottom line is – this is what morality is about isn’t it Jonathan? There are things that we wish to do, there are things that may make us happy, that are wrong.

Jonathan Safran Foer: This isn’t animal experimentation, where you can imagine some proportionate good at the other end of the suffering. This is what we feel like eating. Yet taste, the crudest of our senses, has been exempted from the ethical rules that govern our other senses.

Eugene: People staying silent during the holocaust is precisely what allowed it to happen. With vegans staying silent today, it is no wonder that billions of animals are tortured to death for the most trivial desires of man.

MasterNightfall: I mean, if you put it in front of people that they don’t need something, would be healthier without it, and would reduce the strain on our planet’s resources by abstaining from it… Logic is thrumped by their base desire to consume the tender, succulent fleshes of various exotic and non-exotic beasts.

iFrog: You’re putting a base desire over the welfare and happiness of animals, ignoring compassion and ethical considerations.

Elaine: Taste is a trivial thing. Sure, we all find ourselves doing things that appeal to “base” desires, but when we sit back and get some perspective, we can prioritize and realize that the consequences of our food choices on our health, on the planet, and to animals matter more than taste. Nothing tastes as good as doing the right thing feels.

Larry: Truly the choice is not between happiness or no happiness, but one that is the fruit of such radical values as sacrifice, service, love (for others), and self-denial [versus] one that glories in self (self-indulgence, self-centeredness, and self-identity). Without the helpful voice of Christians speaking the value of the cross, we are left with nothing to sort out the basest of our desires from those which reflect nobility and virtue.

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A Clockwork Vegan

On Sunday, Melissa McEwen at Hunt.Gather.Love offered advice to someone whose vegetarian girlfriend wants to eat meat but is afraid she doesn’t like the taste anymore. (Coincidentally, Richard Nikoley at Free The Animal did a post on the same subject.) The man who emailed Melissa also contacted me, saying “I’ve never not eaten meat, so the idea of not having a taste for it is just completely alien to me.”

I was vegetarian when I first encountered the psychosomatic power of ethical beliefs. At a buffet I bit into a harmless looking slice of pizza that tasted a little strange. As soon as I saw that there was meat hidden beneath the cheese, I felt physically ill and left. I thought my body couldn’t handle meat anymore.

Less than a year later, I was vegan and that cheese would have been just as sickening to me.

I liked meat, dairy and eggs before I became vegetarian and then vegan. Most vegans don’t quit animal products because they hate the taste. They just hate the cruelty. But this moral opposition to animal use can make animal products indefensible and inedible.

This change was so severe in me that trace amounts of animal products were enough to gross me out. This was before the Daiya Fake Cheese Revolution and as much as I wanted to be able to eat a rice-, almond- or soy-based cheese, the casein in those products was a complete turnoff. Even if I’d been willing to bend my ethics, I wouldn’t have wanted to. I visualized that dairy derivative lurking in there and it revolted me.

There haven’t been studies on this phenomenon (shame on you, science), so I can only theorize why this is. But I think it’s pretty obvious that it’s conditioning.

Veganism has only one rule: don’t use animal products. You can slip now and then, but make a habit of it and you’re not vegan anymore –- in fact, you’ve become the thing all vegans hate. So for vegans, it’s pretty damn important not to eat animal products.

This philosophy affects you at every meal. Vegans are constantly thrust into scenarios that test their ethics. Imagine if a horny young Christian had to turn down premarital sex three times a day. Learning to hate animal foods viscerally is the most practical way to stay on the straight and narrow. This is one reason that freeganism is often discouraged. Eating meat that will otherwise be wasted doesn’t increase the demand for it, and that’s the main thing, but vegans worry that by not taming their taste for animal products, freegans are at greater risk of making exceptions and then giving up all together.

Some vegans never develop this aversion either. For them, it can be enough to associate animal products with suffering. Reading about the philosophy and finding support through a message board can keep these meat-loving vegans on the side of good.

But for most vegans, a meat aversion just happens. It’s a byproduct of constantly turning down immoral food. Eventually your subconscious catches on that there’s something wrong with these things. That can be true for diets in general. But veganism is even more dramatic because it goes beyond “That makes me gain weight” to “That food is torture and murder and eating it would make me less of a person.”

Jonathan Safran Foer writes in Eating Animals that being vegetarian is a daily workout of your “compassion muscle”:

[T]he decision to eat with such deliberateness would itself be a force with enormous potential. What kind of world would we create if three times a day we activated our compassion and reason as we sat down to eat, if we had the moral imagination and the pragmatic will to change our most fundamental act of consumption? … [C]ompassion is a muscle that gets stronger with use, and the regular exercise of choosing kindness over cruelty would change us. (257 - 258)

No wonder my vegan brain was so tired!

One of the things that annoys me about Eating Animals is that Foer often discusses vegetarianism as if it’s never been tried before. What would our sons and daughters be like if we raised them vegetarian?! What would Thanksgiving be like without a turkey?! What would happen to someone who chooses to be vegetarian and then sticks with it… would they become hyper-compassionate mutants?!

Why speculate? Foer could have researched Donald Watson, the man who coined “Vegan” and identified as one for the last 60+ years of his life. Did Watson become a hyper-compassionate mutant? Yes! In fact, doctors believe Watson could have lived even longer than the 95 years he pulled off, but his over-stimulated compassion muscle finally outgrew his skull just as his chest burst open from all the love in his heart.

Not really. Like other long-term decisions, once you get used to being vegan, it ceases to be much of a choice. Vegans do not internally debate and renew their pledge against eating animal products at every meal. They open the menu and find the one meat-free entry that can hopefully be made vegan. It’s automatic. Nothing is being exercised other than the reinforcing power of routine.

What is different about veganism is that it doesn’t just take non-vegan options off the table. It makes them repellent. Married people know it would be wrong to cheat, but they don’t consequently find everyone other than their spouse to be completely disgusting. But for a lot of vegans, that is what happens with non-vegan food.

A better analogy than a compassion muscle, then, is the Ludovico treatment in A Clockwork Orange. Vegans make the initial decision to give up animal products, but the conditioning assures they stick with it. Except nobody has to strap vegans to a chair and give them sickness inducing drugs as they stare at photos of meat trays. They do it to themselves.

Figuratively, of course.

veganconditioning

I don’t mean watching slaughterhouse footage, which most vegans don’t do very often. As a vegan, I thought that one of the advantages of giving up animal products was that I didn’t have to watch these things because I wasn’t contributing to them.

It’s the way that vegans think about animal products that turns them into nauseating untouchables. Vegans research where food comes from, which is good, but they tend to focus on the least appealing aspects, at least regarding animal foods. Some vegans, especially the more activist sort, believe that terms like “tortured animal corpses pumped full of antibiotics” “blood- and pus-filled secretions” and “chicken periods” better convey the reality of non-vegan foods than less graphic terms like “meat,” “milk” and “eggs.”

Plants can be disgusting too, if you think about them the way vegans would have us think about animal parts. I had a roommate in college who refused to eat fruit because they were the sexual organs of plants. But you’ll never see PETA referring to fruit as “rotting plant ovary corpses.” Probably because fruit is what PETA wants you to eat. 

Vegans’ vivid, bloody literalizing of animal product terminology is blatantly intended to promote unpleasant connotations. Here is PETA’s take on the odd human tradition of eating “periods” plucked from the ass of a bird:

Besides the fact that each egg eaten represents 34 hours of suffering for chickens (who, as it turns out, score higher than dogs and cats on cognitive tests), when you eat an egg, you’re putting a bird’s period directly into your mouth. Tasty, huh? If you’re going to eat an omelet, you might as well suck on a used tampon.

Not very convincing, but the very existence of such comparisons makes it that much harder to leave veganism.

The health argument for veganism contributes too. According to conventional wisdom, cholesterol and saturated fat are nutritional anti-christs, and vegans have good reason to buy into this — they don’t eat much saturated fat and they eat no cholesterol.

As Billy Thogersen pointed out in my interview with him, vegans sometimes rationalize the existence of healthy looking meat eaters by imagining that their insides are coated with plaque, their veins about to snap shut. Even when vegans have decided meat is healthy and morally okay, and are ready to re-introduce cholesterol and more saturated fat into their diets, this imagery can be hard to shake.

And then there are stories vegans tell each other about ex-vegans who started eating animal products again and felt sick. These are mostly myths but they add to the perception that animal products are something to fear, and not just for ethics.

This is a great way to think if you want to keep yourself vegan. “Meat is gross and wrong!” is easier to stick to than “Meat is delicious and nutritious and I want it but unfortunately that would be unethical.”

It becomes a problem, though, when a vegan wants to take the next logical step into ex-veganism.

As Melissa and some of her commenters pointed out, eating little bits of meat at a time helps. Sushi is a good start because it’s surrounded by a protective coating of veggies and grains. Small portions of meat overwhelmed by vegetables was my route.

Many vegeterians and vegans weren’t exposed to a wide variety of animal products before they gave them up. Raw fish and duck, two things I’d never had before my vegan years, are probably my favorite foods now. So aspiring ex-vegans should also try small doses of animal products that they’ve never tasted. If pork chops weren’t enough to keep you out of veganism, they may not be the best way out.

Like a lot of ex-vegans, you might eventually find yourself eating the organs, tendons and bones that terrify many lifelong omnivores. I wonder if these ex-vegans develop a love for the “nasty bits” as a final triumph over the period of their lives when they thought every part of the animal was a nasty bit.

--Tagged under: Purity--

--Tagged under: SelfDenial--

Do Vegans Dream of Delicious Meat?

Sleeping Vegan

Noone: This disturbing event happened to me last night. I was dreaming that Arby’s was having a big sale on roast beef and I ended up getting a sandwich and eating it. Before eating it in the dream, I had second thoughts but ate it anyway. After I ate it, in the dream, I freaked out over it - then I woke up and realized - much to my relief - that it was a dream.

Rosemary: I have had a couple of dreams about eating bacon. I will be eating bacon and thinking, this is good, I wonder why I don’t have bacon more often?

superwife: man, i had a dream the other night that i was sitting at a table with a bunch of people and someone served us all breakfast burritos… everyone (myself included) was moving in synch… it was like synchronized eating. we all picked up the burritos and took a bite, and much to my horror, it was eggs and sausage! i had to keep eating because we were all doing the same thing and for some reason i couldn’t not do it… but i felt terrible!

hazelfaern: (responding to above) Sounds disturbing, but also like a pretty cool metaphor for compulsive conformity.

its_a_gas: Just last week, I had a dream that I was eating some Fantastic Foods vegetarian “chicken noodle” soup. I started reading the nutritional info on the back, and saw that gelatin was listed as one of the ingredients. I woke up thinking that it was real. I was completely horrified for a few minutes.

erasmus: I have had quite a few dreams about eating meat or dairy since I decided to stop eating those things. One time, I actually ate a whole, raw frog! I’ve stopped having these dreams, however, much to my satisfaction. Now, when I’m offered meat in my dreams I always turn it down.

kristeenamarie: It’s sort of odd but last year every few weeks I’d have a dream that I was eating a hamburger and I’d wake up crying.

magick_nuts: Never had dreams of eating meat but i have a recurring dream where i don’t realize a KitKat is milk chocolate and start eating it. Then i realize, so i look around and see no one else has noticed, and carry on eating.

Tofuy: i dreamed i ate two of those foot-long hot dogs. i could clearly see and smell or whatever all the grease and the crinkles on the hot dog skin. i woke up sick that next morning and threw up twice that day. one of those times was on my dads foot, which was cool.

vegancellist: i dream about food a lot but never meat. Plantains, sprouts, cabbage, etc. Yesterday i had a dream that i went to a restaurant and they had chilled blueberry soup. It looked amazing but i found out that it had butter in it. i was really sad in the dream because the soup was so pretty.

slackar: I ate some huge ass chunk of lobster in a dream the other day. Another lobster was eating it, so I felt justified in doing it too, apparently.

eemal: not long ago, i had a dream i was in Louisiana, at a relative’s house. we were out by the car, all talking, and we were parked under an apple tree. i grabbed an apple, and whilst opening my mouth to take a huge bite, it ended up being a raw chicken leg quarter. i was sickened and horrified. i spit it out, and looked at the bloody carnage, and spit and spit and spit and spit, yet STILL felt guilty that I’d taken a bite of an animal, however deceptively or inadvertently. i was so horrified that i awoke SCREAMING.

My hubby asked if I’d had a nightmare, and i replied “YES! I DREAMT I BIT A CHICKEN LEG QUARTER!!!” And he, though he’s vegan as well, looked at me like i was a nut. Well, not 2-3 weeks later, he had a VERY SIMILAR DREAM, even though i hadn’t told him the details of my dream: he also dreamt that he grabbed an apple off a tree that ended up being a raw chicken appendage once he bit into it. Alas, HE awoke screaming as well.

Drew!: I had a semi-lucid experience last night where I was dreaming that I was in a virtual world type video game. I was sitting at a table and there was mac and cheese being passed around. I remember thinking, “I can eat this! it isn’t real!” But i had reservations because I thought I was endorsing a non-vegan lifestyle.

Inspiration: I have had multiple nightmares where I accidentally consume meat. Shortly after these mistakes I wind up trying to make myself throw up, which is my plan if I ever do accidentally consume animal products.

slackar: Had another dream that I ate meat. I was eating drumsticks (or was I eating chicken legs?), and then caught myself. All of a sudden, I was like, “oh crap. I’m vegan. What the fizzuckz am I doing?” Yet I still continued to chew away. I then kept wondering to myself (in the dream) how I was going to explain my actions to the people here at Vegan Represent. Sad, huh?

Rebbie: Every once in a while, I will start to “miss” eating meat. On those days when I think about it I will go to sleep and dream about cows getting their throats slit and begging me to save them while they bleed to death. Very disturbing.

Ahimsabland: In my dream last night I was at some bizarre place which ended up being an abandoned zoo. I was there with a few friends and we were hungry, so of course we went to the canteen to see what was being offered. The ladies at the cash registers weren’t familiar with the term “Vegan” so I had to explain to them that I didn’t eat any animals or animal derived products. They ended up giving me a cheese and ham sandwich (i didn’t eat this one, the meat and cheese were clearly hanging out the sides of the sub) and I started to become frustrated with them.

“I DON’T eat animal products!” I said. “If you can’t give me a sandwich with just salads I will torch your house,” I unnecessarily yelled at the large woman.

I ended up getting a lettuce and spinach sandwich which turned out to be quite delicious, very flavorsome for something so simple.

Then when i was halfway through the sandwich, I discovered there were no greens, but actually chunks of ham and many slices of cheese infesting the inside of my sandwich. Also, the bread was made out of egg, and there was butter instead of oil! To top it off, I had elitist vegan friends observing my terrible mistake, who no longer were my friends.

I felt as though I murdered another human being and experienced a variety of harsh negative emotions for the rest of the dream.

I ended up being naked with no money or no way of getting home.

spacehippy: I’ve had perhaps a dozen meat-eating dreams. I don’t think we really have to worry, though, since meat in dreams technically qualifies as being vegan.

Herbi: Just a few weeks ago I had a dream that I was vehemently arguing pro-veganism with my family while simultaneously grilling and eating an entire bird of some sort. Don’t let some meatie Psych undergrad convince you that it necessarily means we want/need/crave meat! (though I guess technically it could… not helping matters, am I?)

--Tagged under: Vegan Quotes--

--Tagged under: SelfDenial--

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